Cheeseburger Gothic

I have forgotten how money works

Posted January 30 by John Birmingham

I landed in Rome a day and a half ago and have been reacquainting myself with the city. Some things have changed. The Romans now obey the traffic signals, which is great. And some things haven’t. They still refuse to queue in an orderly fashion for anything.

One thing that’s changed about me; I’ve forgotten how to use cash. There’s no real contactless payment infrastructure here. Credit cards and eftpos, yes. But no PayPass as we’d recognise it.

Cash still rules. When I was last here it was Lire, which was awesome because you could feel like a millionaire for very little actual money. Now it’s the Euro, which is fine, because it makes everything seem cheap. (And of course somethings like pasta and wine are cheap). But I’ve found myself frequently standing with mouth agape and drool dropping slowly from my lower lip as I try to remember how the whole paper money thing works. Turns out it’s a minor life skill and it can quickly decay.

I’m very slow at counting notes. Even slower at recognising denominations. More than once I’ve just pushed a bunch of paper at the cashier with my apologies. The Romans, thankfully, are always happy to divest you of the appropriate amount.

I think.

8 Responses to ‘I have forgotten how money works’

NBlob has opinions thus...

Posted January 30
Heading to Japan Saturday, very much a cash economy. I’m pretty reasonable at mental arithmetic but $1 AUD = 74 Yen is doing my head in.

Bangar mutters...

Posted February 1
Easy cheat old school paper table, new school a note on your phone. Whatever works for you $A1 to 100 with local equivalence or local $ to $A. Yes you can use apps but this is available straight away without the net

NBlob reckons...

Posted February 11
Arigato Bangar san. I’ve returned with both knees pointing the correct direction but calves which have applied For asylum. Quite an experience to be effectively illiterate in Europe even without local language you can work things out, in Japan, with 2 or even 3 alphabets, depending on how one counts, I had a hell of a time. This bus is going to squiggle house thing an 2 stripes with a dot, but not angry face rhomboid and tree, or is that just an add for disgusting peach cola?

Bangar ducks in to say...

Posted Friday
I've always thought Japan would be ... interesting to visit.

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jl would have you know...

Posted January 31
I remember Italy and the Lira. All those zeroes...

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insomniac swirls their brandy and claims...

Posted January 31
I wish we'd used more cash while in LA in November because the dodgy way you have to pay with a card in restaurants has lead to our cards being used elsewhere in attempted transactions. Luckily the bank's defence systems held up but you still have the inconvenience of cancelling old/getting new cards.

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she_jedi has opinions thus...

Posted January 31
Egypt is great for the many zeroes thing. When my tour group visited the pyramids and we were given the option to climb inside the Great Pyramid for 300 Egyptian pounds I was taken aback, and then did the conversion and realised it was about $25 Australian. Needless to say I paid happily. It absolutely murdered my thigh muscles but was a once in a lifetime experience.

It was a shock when we got to Jordan later in the trip and discovered that 1 Jordanian dollar was 2 Aussie dollars though!

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Dirk asserts...

Posted February 5
Well JB, we made them Euro's color-coded, especially for you :D darkgreen is 5, red is 10, blue is 20, and orange is 50. The rest we don't use that much, but if you were to come by a stack of purple ones, you know where I live ... :D

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Deadline Psyche

Posted January 24 into Writing by John Birmingham

I’ve been on deadline for a couple of weeks now, hammering away at the keys, croaking into the dictation rig, all aimed at finishing THE SHATTERED SKIES, the second book in the Cruel Stars series, before I get on a flight to Rome on Monday.

No way am I finishing that book.

But that’s okay. I knew there was no chance I would ever finish it in time, because...

NARRATOR VOICE: The deadline was coming from inside his head!

Cue Wilhelm Scream.

The deadline wasn’t set by my publishers. I did it to myself to avoid coming back from Europe in mid Feb with a truly impossible job to do. So for the last three weeks I’ve been cranking on 4000 words a day, or trying to, simply to get into a position where I could finish the manuscript at a more leisurely 2000 words a day when I get home.

Mission accomplished. I should have about 75-80K words in the bank by Monday.

One thing I am gonna try while I'm away is writing a couple of pars, here and there, that aren't driving the plot - they're just nice writing. I had a look through my story plan, plucked out a couple of scenes that are mostly descriptive, and opened some documents in Bear, the rather nifty little writing app I have on my iPhone for stuff like this. Maybe I'll never open those documents again. But hopefully I will as an alternative to, say, mindlessly browsing a Twitter feed if I find myself with ten minutes to wait for a train, or an hour or two on that train.

Example. I have to describe a ring world called Cupertino.

It's a megastructure, a Culture Orbital, as designed by Apple, or what Apple becomes given 700 years. At the moment I have no idea what it's like other than it's very big and very nice. Rather than breaking flow on the action driven plot to spend an hour or so describing this thing, I'm just going to play with the idea like a prose poem over the next three weeks and see what I have at the end of it.

The idea is I can then just cut and paste the words into the manuscript when the time comes.

9 Responses to ‘Deadline Psyche’

Barnesm would have you know...

Posted January 24
That sounds like a delightful idea.
I admit my first thought was "why is the orbital named after a San Francisco fish stew?", and realised that's Cioppino. Duck Duck Go pointed out that Cupertino is a neighborhood in California.

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Dave W has opinions thus...

Posted January 24
I used to do this kind of thing when I was working on my M.A., busy with work, on a real deadline for an essay. For the side points on the essay I'd use a bit of micro-spare time and pencil down whatever it was. I found it useful, even if I didn't use it, for getting those side points out of my head. Damn things could take up too much space in there.

she_jedi is gonna tell you...

Posted January 24
I'm intrigued by your strategy around side points. The number of times I've gone down a side point rabbit hole in an essay for uni and then had to backtrack out of it... I will try this on the next one and see if it helps keep this stuff out of my head :)

Dave W is gonna tell you...

Posted January 24
Gulp- Results may vary!

she_jedi mumbles...

Posted January 24
I certainly won't hold you responsible for my application of your technique and the results that follow!

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Matthew F. would have you know...

Posted January 24
I'd be interested in a little review of Bear if you have a few minutes and a mind to do it. I took a quick look at it but it's hard to get a sense of what it's like to use. There's a subscription mentioned - did you get that or is it available as a one-and-done purchase?

John Birmingham ducks in to say...

Posted January 24
I bought it outright, but I’ll check the sub model and write a quickie review. I do like it as a note taker.

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Vovchara mumbles...

Posted January 26
I have rather of topic question.
Why the hell are you traveling to Europe in February? Saying as someone who just spend freezing up my arse outside.

John Birmingham reckons...

Posted January 27
I like winter food.

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Tradies and deadlines

Posted January 22 by John Birmingham

I've written before about the inevitability of losing fitness when on deadline. It seems unavoidable. Extra hours at the desk. Fewer hours at gym. More snack food.

I'm on a self imposed deadline at the moment. One I'll miss, for sure. I set myself the goal of finishing a first draft of the sequel to The Cruel Stars by next Monday, because on Monday night Jane and I catch a flight to Rome.

I'm okay with missing it. I gave myself a ridiculous deadline to make sure I didn't come home in three weeks to an even more ridiculous deadline. I'll be about 75-80% done with THE SHATTERED SKIES when I down tools on Monday and will polish it off in about a fortnight when I get back.

I'm been smashing out four thousand and five thousand word days the past couple of weeks (the benefits of a tightly plotted narrative outline) but hit a wall today.

Why? There was a tradie in the house. Usually it's electricians or plumbers. They can sniff a deadline a mile away. Today's was a glazier to fix a broken window. He was good guy. Punctual. Efficient. Did the job well. But there is something about having a worker in the house that does my head in. I just can't concentrate.

It was exacerbated by having to deal with some malware that'd snuck onto Thomas's new MacBook Air. A factory reset seemed the easiest way to nuke that gremlin, since the Air is only a couple of weeks old.

Between them they pulled me back from 4-5K all the way down 1800 words.

About to try grind out another thousand before I crash.

6 Responses to ‘Tradies and deadlines’

she_jedi puts forth...

Posted January 23
Is it the presence of another person in the house that throws out your routine, rather than a tradie or a stranger specifically? If the kids or Jane are on holidays and mooching around the house does this mess up your deadlines as well, or are you used to them and filter them out?


The killer for me on deadlines (which are all uni assignments at the moment), are my Feline Overlords detecting that a) I appear to be busy and b) appear to be busy doing things that do not involve giving them food or cuddles, and this must be STOPPED so that c) food and cuddles can be distributed accordingly.

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jason mumbles...

Posted January 23
The real question here is how did you get an actual Tradie to your house. I thought these were myths. If you say they were on time and reasonably priced i will call you out as a bald faced liar.

insomniac is gonna tell you...

Posted January 23
No doubt there's a lot of "Don't you know who I am" going on, and perhaps "If you don't do as I say, I'm going to kill you...(whispers) in my next book".

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Barnesm has opinions thus...

Posted January 24
I admit I am distracted by wanting to watch them work if it's okay with them. Watching someone who is competent and experienced at a task is very satisfying to my mood.

Dave W would have you know...

Posted January 24
And even more satisfying is the beer you get to have for a job vicariously well done.

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Rob mutters...

Posted January 27
Malware on an Apple product? my oh my , how the world has changed....

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Jason Lambright's 1917 review

Posted January 20 into Movies by John Birmingham

I won't get to see this one big screen because of my deadline, but I had been looking forward to Jason's take. His review, like the film, does not disappoint.

Right up front I’d like to say that I’m not a big war movie guy. But if I do go to one, it needs to be historically and physically accurate. Historical accuracy is obvious- uniforms, gear, and scenery needs to be right. But what do I mean by physical accuracy? Allow me to explain. I don’t want to see people acting like clowns when they are supposed to be shot. By the same token, I do not want to see them take round after round and keep functioning.

It doesn’t work that way.

You can read the whole piece at his blog.

11 Responses to ‘Jason Lambright's 1917 review’

she_jedi has opinions thus...

Posted January 20
That was a top notch review Mr Lambright, you've persuaded me to go see this!

jl is gonna tell you...

Posted January 20
No spoilers, but when you do go see it, look at the barbed wire obstacles. Then imagine attacking, rifle in hand, as bullets and shrapnel snap, flutter and whistle by. It is very easy to imagine how an entire generation was lost in those horrid muddy pits.

she_jedi would have you know...

Posted January 21
I will, thanks Jason!

she_jedi mumbles...

Posted February 3
I finally saw 1917 yesterday; an incredible movie. I was quietly horrified by the barbed wire obstacles, I was watching for them like you advised. When the credits rolled the movie buddy I was with just sat quietly and absorbed everything we'd seen, and we agreed on a quiet 'wow'. Afterwards we went to dinner and raved about it, but it was a truly stunning piece of film, from two people who are not usually big fans of war movies. What I found ironic in hindsight was that navigating the barbed wire was the least eventful part of the movie, but completely chilling to watch.

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Vovchara puts forth...

Posted January 23
Mr. Lambright, you are talking my language. Ok, grammatically improved version :)
As I get older, I get increasingly more irritated with Hollywood, where "Rule of Cool" rules supreme, completely overlooking the fact, that Realism is a lot cooler.
Although to be absolutely honest, I would prefer a movie about WW 1.1 or WW 2.1, with a realistic extrapolation of alternate history.

she_jedi reckons...

Posted January 23
Gee if only we had a thoroughly plotted and complete source material to draw upon for a project of this nature....

jason mumbles...

Posted January 23
Mr Lambright might just have what you are looking for in terms oF WW1.1

she_jedi mumbles...

Posted January 23
Oh yes, I beta read that one, so good!

Vovchara has opinions thus...

Posted January 23
Now you are just being mean. Where is it?

she_jedi would have you know...

Posted January 24
I think it's still a work in progress, Mr Lambright hasn't mentioned a release date yet :(

jl puts forth...

Posted January 24
You are right, she_jedi.

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I’m suing Samsung

Posted January 20 into Science and Tech by John Birmingham

I totally invented their projected keyboard on a cafe table in Weapons of Choice.

The New York Post reporters:

In the realm of traditional technology, CES 2020 continues to deliver gadgets both revolutionary and bizarre.

Samsung unveiled a new, experimental smartphone feature that can create an AI-powered “invisible keyboard” on the surface of any desk or tabletop.

The South Korean tech giant’s “SelfieType” keyboard app uses a phone’s front-facing selfie camera to track the movements of a user’s fingers as they tap out words and sentences on any flat surface. An artificial-intelligence engine analyzes the movements and converts them into text on a smartphone, tablet or laptop.

How much do you think I can get?

7 Responses to ‘I’m suing Samsung’

jason mutters...

Posted January 20
The real money will be when someone invents a working time machine and you can claim royalties on that, once you fight of the Estate of H.G. Wells of course.

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FormerlyKnownAsSimon is gonna tell you...

Posted January 20
I reckon a reconditioned S5 with a side helping of 10 year old viruses . . . : )

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insomniac puts forth...

Posted January 20
I wonder if it would be enough to fuck their patent application. It is possible to submit prior art to the patent office as a third party. It would be interesting, especially as Samsung would have to address it and that response would be published.

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Barnesm puts forth...

Posted January 20
Good luck, I'm unfamiliar with the ins and outs of commercial law, is it still settled in a trial by combat?

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Matthew F. ducks in to say...

Posted January 20
Weren't ThinkGeek selling those in, like, the 90s?

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jl swirls their brandy and claims...

Posted January 20
This is super cool.

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Rob asserts...

Posted January 27
hrmmm can't copyright an idea, you can patent an idea/invention , but its got to be working to get approved.

But hey, Disney made Mickey Mouse exist as property forever, so lets ask Scotty from Marketing about it and get things changed for you.

Its only fair.



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A land, once mighty, now in thrall to pissants and cowards

Posted January 15 by John Birmingham

Not that I want to change the Burger into the Climate Change Blog, but I do have this piece running at The New Daily which compares the strange disconnect between the Right's rhetoric on military preparedness, with the same people's rhetoric on a more immediate existential threat.

Modern Australian pointlessness is much less benign. Currently it is most often and most destructively used in arguments that, because we’re so small and so far away and because our greenhouse gas emissions are such a tiny fraction of the global total, it would be futile, damaging and even dangerous for us to contemplate unilateral carbon disarmament. Our carbon emissions keep us strong. We cannot afford to give them up before anybody else.

It’s a rubbish argument.

Oddly enough the same coal-fired demagogues are never backward in coming forward when the chance arises for Australia to make a contribution to some military adventure in which our token company of special forces or nominal contribution of an AWACs aircraft is framed as a vital commitment to burden sharing, or alliance management, or saving the world from whatever sub-Bond villains are currently choosing to menace it with forty-year-old Kalashnikovs from the dusty backstreets of far away Absurdistan.

You can read it here.

25 Responses to ‘A land, once mighty, now in thrall to pissants and cowards’

jason asserts...

Posted January 15
Two responses.

When people talk about the fact that our emissions are pretty small I counter with this argument: If everyone else in your street beats their partners daily and you only beat your's on Saturday it doesn't mean your doing the right thing or that you cant help. It's up to you to stand up and set an example and show people a better way.

We are missing out on an awesome opportunity to steal a march on the whole world follow this link to see why https://insidestory.org.au/here-comes-the-sun/

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insomniac is gonna tell you...

Posted January 15
The argument that countries 5 to 30 in the emissions levels banding together to make something significant happen is a powerful one.
There's another country even closer to the arse end of the world that intends to do its bit even if it is a small one, which is why I will never not be a New Zealander.

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Barnesm mutters...

Posted January 15
Clear salient points, I struggle with how I respond after pointing out this disconnect in the persons thinking and they still don't seem to even reconsider their point of view. How to we progress when as fundamental aspect of the discussion as logic/reason isn't persuasive.

andrew has opinions thus...

Posted January 15
Tragically, in a world of bullshit, where truth and falsity are irrelevant, opinions are formed tribally, entirely on the basis of the feels.

IMO the best chance of a good outcome is to appeal to these folks' profit motive, and keep pointing out how much money is to be made exporting clean energy and the products of free energy.

Perhaps I'm wrong, but reason and facts aren't working.

jl puts forth...

Posted January 15
Good piece. Appeals to the wallet are usually the most effective. And BTW forty year old Kalashnikovs are pretty new. I've got a picture of one made in 1948, perfectly good working order.

she_jedi would have you know...

Posted January 15
I think a lot of the denialism is driven by fear. They really just don't want to believe the science, because they don't want it to be true. If it's true then they have to change the way they live and work, and people as a collective are resistant to change. And I think our messaging has been a bit arse about over the last decade too. Instead of pointing out the Mad Max style apocalypse we can all look forward (and as of this summer in Australia, experience), we really should have been pushing the mega dollars and technological transformation we could wring out of a zero carbon economy, and tout the new industrial revolution we could kick off if we only had the courage to grasp the nettle. That bullshit line the Coalition ran on Labor coming for your utes and your weekend was a classic example of how we should have been pointing out the amazing shit we could do with electric vehicles 2 elections ago, instead of reacting to a line of total bullshit by a party of deniers.

jl has opinions thus...

Posted January 15
You're onto something, Jedi of the She. Look at the sweet electric vehicles Musk and co. are producing, and how the US Big Three are climbing aboard. They can see the writing on the wall, and they want to keep making money. Ref: Wall Street Journal articles this past month. LOL moment? GM plans on re-introducing the Hummer line under its GMC brand, only this time it will be electric instead of an insanely inefficient 10mpg lump of steel.

she_jedi mutters...

Posted January 15
I'm not going to lie, Elon Musk's CyberTruck was batshit insane looking, but I fucking loved it. I'm confident that I'm on my last ICE car, a much adored Mazda CX-3, and when it's time to replace it I'll be looking at whatever the electric equivalent is Mazda produces. They already have a prototype out that looks pretty schmick (not CyberTruck levels of bold, but you can't have everything): https://www.mazda.com.au/cars/mazda-ev/

Matthew F. asserts...

Posted January 15
I'm with you SJ, we're buying another car this year and the plan is for a full electric - we like the Hyundai Ioniq so far but who knows what the market will look like by the time we have our bucks together?

Have you seen this firm in QLD who do electric conversions, and even sell kits so you can switch your burner to an electric yourself?

https://www.ozdiyelectricvehicles.com/

They make the point that the best cars for conversion are the smaller, older cars you can get for almost nothing nowadays, and that you can recoup a lot of what you spend on one by selling the engine you won't be using any more. I've caught myself once or twice trying to run the numbers on whether one could run a business buying up those older cars, electrifying them and selling them on again. (I'm nowhere near handy enough to get under the bonnet myself but I could be the silent partner/front office guy.)

she_jedi mumbles...

Posted January 15
I did not know about electric conversion kits! That's so cool! That's also a neat idea for a business too, because surely a market would open up for cheaper converted junkers for those who can only dream of a brand new car, and would contribute to the removal of ICE cars from our roads (and provide a transition path for low income car owners when petrol stops being a thing). I too am completely non-handy mechanically, but if you could partner with a good mechanic your idea would definitely have legs (and a front office/sales guy would be essential) :)

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Naut mumbles...

Posted January 15
I liked it

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Moko has opinions thus...

Posted January 15
I'm not really convinced it's an immediate existential threat everyone seems to think it is, but I haven't looked into it either. I drive a 2 ltr turbo. I don't burn shit in the back yard. Happy to consider renewable energies. I sue those fucken green bags from woolies and forget to take one so Ive got like 74 of them ... Yadda yadda. Got other shit keeping me awake at night, and honestly, a comet (metaphorical or meterorical (coining that one for future use) landing on the species would do the planet the world of good (accidental pun fun).

Moko has opinions thus...

Posted January 15
*use those...

jason puts forth...

Posted January 16
Lets make a deal. You buy Green Power for your house and that's all you need to do. Then you can rest easy knowing you did your part. Better yet, invest in solar. Saves you money in the long run and you have done your part.

Mark Duffett mumbles...

Posted January 16
Sorry, but I don't think that is all one needs to do, remembering that only a third of Australian electricity is used in households. You might not be using the other two thirds directly in your house, but you're likely as dependent on the industrial edifice that does as anybody. All the energy embodied in absolutely everything in your home, all the electricity being used in the businesses you patronise, the hospitals, the food refrigeration and on it goes, all comes from that other two thirds and it's got to come from somewhere. And that somewhere has to be paid for...by all of us.

jason is gonna tell you...

Posted January 17
Agree, but as far as personal action goes, if you aren't prepared to storm the barricades then this simple action will cover you.

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Chrisg is gonna tell you...

Posted January 15
Fantastic article, I have shared it with many Hoping it hits home

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Dirk ducks in to say...

Posted January 16
Unless the house of one of the politicians in power burns down, or worse, probably nothing is gonna happen. Which is a shame.

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Mark Duffett is gonna tell you...

Posted January 16
Funnily enough a kind of mirror image piece appeared in Quillette a couple of weeks ago, pointing out the strange disconnect between the apocalyptic rhetoric of many on the Left and the same people's fussiness about the modest half-baked climate solutions they're prepared to countenance.

https://quillette.com/2020/01/02/false-humility-will-not-save-the-planet/

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Matthew F. has opinions thus...

Posted January 17
Maybe this is just my own confirmation bias but I'm noticing a growing trend in among the "how do we make these people get their shit together" and "how do we turf these people out and put in people who have their shit together" of "fuck it, we go around them".

What workable ways are there to go around them?

We've done enough sitting around being angry for one another. We've done more than enough pounding on the door demanding action from people who just laugh at us. What are some things we could do from the ground up that will have a purple-faced spluttering Scummo on the phone in a year or two screaming "what do you fucking mean 'they went and did it themselves'?"

Dave W reckons...

Posted January 17
I'd expect Scummo to be claiming credit for it- as in "the Australian people are very happy that the Government has created the conditions for meaningful action by the private sector...".

But I do worry that the ground-up stuff is well understood, and has been done to a large extent. I'd love to know how the bypass option can be of a magnitude to be meaningful but doable by private citizens.

she_jedi mutters...

Posted January 17
The only way to go around the feds is to get the states to just get on with it themselves. Which to be fair they're starting to do. We need to be applying pressure on our state governments to act. Prior to the carbon price NSW was developing its own carbon pricing scheme, then abandoned that when Gillard introduced the federal one... and we all know how that ended.

The Guardian is already calling for Smoko to be circumvented in order to save the planet: https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2020/jan/17/if-the-bushfires-wont-force-climate-policy-change-we-need-to-circumvent-scott-morrison

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Halwes ducks in to say...

Posted January 17
Australia's major greenhouse emissions come from exported coal. I think that the government needs to be honest and say that, as our second largest export earner, if we stop exporting coal then the living standards in this country will plummet for a while until we can think up something else to export like hydrogen etc. If Australians, even feel a blimp in their living standards they will cry like babies and wont back any sort of greenhouse gas reduction in my opinion. Also, unless you are charging those new electric vehicles with renewables then you are not going to reduce greenhouse emissions one iota. This especially with the huge greenhouse gas load of producing the things in the first place ie mining, manufacturing and disposing of batteries etc. Probably less greenhouse gas in keeping your old cars at least until they are no longer serviceable. I am always willing to be corrected with facts though.

she_jedi asserts...

Posted January 17
I'm curious, mainly because I don't know, how much of our coal exports actually contribute to the standard of living of the average Aussie. Coal is our second biggest export after iron ore, so contributes enormously to the country's bottom line, but we're also subsiding that industry to the tune of $12 billion a year. While shutting down the coal industry would have an impact on the standard of living of coal workers and the towns they live in, would it really impact the standard of living of the rest of the country? And wouldn't this be where a just transition come into play, to help transfer those workers to other industries and careers, so that their standard of living doesn't collapse. Something like, I dunno, a renewable energy industry?

I read an opinion somewhere that we could shut down the coal industry completely, give all the people working in coal at the moment (all 37,800 of them) $100k a year for the rest of their working lives, and the budget would still be better off because that $12 billion subsidy would no longer be required (eg, we'd have change left over after paying the former coal workers. It's not like any coal mining companies are actually paying tax in this country). I'm not an economist so I can't comment on the figures, and it was an opinion, not verifiable fact. But when we talk about going 100% renewable in our energy production, there's nothing stopping us from going 150%, 200% or 300% renewable, and exporting the excess energy to Asia. Which Twiggy Forrest and Mike Cannon-Brookes are already looking at doing with a solar farm in the NT. How can we get the average Australian to vote for that sort of economic transformation instead?

Halwes has opinions thus...

Posted January 18
Very interesting thanks. I didn't know much of what you've stated at all. I'd really be interested to know what the impact of a cessation in coal mining would actually be. The trouble is that the 37,800 people spend their money in towns that support coal mining operations. The figure is much higher when the service industry populations of these towns is factored in. Labor and the Greens were very stupid when they suggested shutting down the coal industry with out transitioning their economies to other industries first. The people there were faced with intergenerational unemployment and massive devaluations of their houses. It's not hard to guess who they would have voted for. I think that renewably generated hydrogen is part of the answer and that solar panel renewables are also a bit of a false economy / carbon saving. The greenhouse gasses that are generated in the manufacture of panels are fairly high. Also there are starting to be large piles of used panels, usually lower price and inferior components, that need recycling. The average Australian that you refer to is as dumb as crap in my opinion and will always vote according to whatever their hip pocket nerve feels like so the transformation will need to be cheap and to not affect their lifestyles. Too many people make too much money from fossil fuels. It's raining now and the climate change deniers will be out in force until the next drought. Hopefully we can elevate the discussion and really start levelling with each other. I can't take too much more of the political double talk. Australians are incredibly polarised politically and this issue will not be discussed intelligently until a bi partisan approach is taken.

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